Jamat ud Dawa Pakistan

Voice of Islam

Archives Voice Mags

It is obligatory for UN to define terrorism in its real perspective: Hameed Gul

Lt. General (rtd) Hameed Gul, former chief of Pakistan’s intelligence agency, ISI and renowned defense expert needs no introduction. He played a key role in pushing the Soviet Union back on the other side of river Oxus during the Afghan Jihad. He has always preferred to work for national and religious pride instead of falling prey to foreign influence and expediencies. He feels that the future of the freedom movements in Kashmir, Palestine, Chechnya, Iraq and Afghanistan lies in Jihad.

Correspondents of Voice of Islam- Abu Umair and Aftab Hussain recently conducted a detailed interview with Hamed Gul on issues of national and international importance.

 Interveiw panel Abu Umair and Aftab Husseinnn

Voice of Islam: How do you perceive the overall situation in Pakistan?

Hameed Gul: The situation in the country can be viewed in two ways. Firstly, the country is passing through very critical times. A number of problems have sneaked into the system. Politicians and army are at odds. President General Pervez Musharraf has failed to implement the reform agenda he announced on November 17, 1999. Our Foreign Policy has failed to deliver the goods. India is not heeding to our assertions. US is all-praise for Musharraf but very much antagonistic vis-à-vis Pakistan. The entire nation is in a state of despondency. No body knows what future has in store for us. The genie of unemployment has gripped every segment of the society. The continuation of colonial system has stopped us from achieving the lofty ideals for which Pakistan was established. It is very disheartening that Pakistan became a tool for the accomplishment of US policies despite the fact that these were against our national interests. This has also led to nation’s failures on different fronts.

The bright side of the picture is that Talisman of the United States and its cronies is coming to an end. The things have become very crystal clear. The nation is quite disappointed with the institutions it used to trust blindly in the past. So the era of idol-worship is about to end. Now the nation will move forward with a new zeal and zest.

How the things got better. It was all due to undesired attitude of the world imperialist forces. Now the nation fully knows how the imperialistic forces made use of us and how we presented our services. It is aware that the defeat of the world imperialism will result in opening up of the doors of opportunities that are closed for centuries.

Voice of Islam: President General Pervez Musharraf while announcing to side with world coalition against terrorism had said that Pakistan was siding with US to save its strategic assets like nuclear program, economy and Kashmir. Has Musharraf achieved these objectives?

Hameed Gul: Unfortunately, we have not been able to accomplish it. US is still deadly against our nuclear program. Kashmir issue is alive just due to Jihad waged by people against India. Governments have no role in the resistance being put up by some people against the occupation forces in Afghanistan, Iraq and other places.

The decisions taken by President General Pervez Musharraf in the wake of September 11 incident were not right. Support to the US was not a decision of entire nation, but a group of few persons. Even the future generations would feel a sense of guilt over this decision. The situation would change drastically after the upcoming Presidential elections in the United States. So in short, Pakistan has failed to achieve the objectives it set while announcing support to the US-led war on terrorism. As far as country’s economy is concerned, it is nothing more than a statistical jugglery.

Voice of Islam: The West and the United States term Jihad equivalent to terrorism. To you, what is the difference between Jihad and terrorism?

Hameed Gul: Now a days, Jihad is being given the name of terrorism. But no body is actually talking about the real terrorism. It was Youna Bomber that used to carry out terroristic acts in the US universities. Christian fundamen-talists were behind the Oklahoma bombings. But little has been said about these incidents. Similarly, the West seems to be oblivious of the acts of terrorism being committed by Iris Republican Army (IRA). So word terrorism is being referred for only Jihad. They also give Jihad, the name of resistance. This is the resistance backed by a sound and solid ideology. So West is not tolerating a resistance that is based on a divine order.

Voice of Islam: Then who should give a comprehensive definition of terrorism?

Hameed Gul: This the responsibility of the United Nations to define the term of terrorism in a comprehensive manner. Pakistan, instead of supporting US, should have convened the meeting of Organization of Islamic Conference on the eve of US attack on Afghanistan to have a collective decision on the invasion of an Islamic state. The Muslim countries should have asked the US to define the term terrorism before attacking any Muslim world.

Voice of Islam: A crack down on Islamic movements is in progress in the name of war on terrorism. Is it due to foreign pressure?

Hameed Gul : You are right. This is definitely due to foreign pressure. We are killing our own people. There is need of distinguishing between the looters of national exchequer and those laying lives for freedom. Those who looted the country, are dear to the governments while the ones, laying down lives for their co-religionists are in trouble. This is a big contradiction. This paradoxical approach will be even source of guilt for the coming generations.

Voice of Islam: Some circles believe that what ever is going on in South Waziristan, is due to US dictation. Is it so?

Hameed Gul: I would like to tell that the tribes of South Waziristan, Mehsuds and Wazirs, played a pivotal role in liberating the part of Kashmir, now known as Azad Kashmir at the time of Independence. These tribesmen with Islamic thinking have always worked for the defense of Pakistan. It was the same tribesmen who marched till Sri Nagar to support the Kashmiri Mujahideen on the call of Quaid-e-Azam Muhammad Ali Jinnah. Had Prime Minister Liaquat Ali Khan taken firm stand and not accepted the cease-fire, the entire Kashmir could have been liberated. A study of Pakistan’s history shows that only military feat of the country is the liberation of Azad Kashmir. Army, but the Mujahideen from Wana and Waziristan did not liberate even this area. Azad Kashmir is the only symbol of our national pride in military terms. Otherwise, we have nothing to take pride on military level.

Voice of Islam: Should Pakistan send its troops to Iraq or not?

Hameed Gul: I have written on this issue long ago. My article on ‘Whether Pakistan should send troops to Iraq, appeared on July 14,2003 when this issue came to the fore first time. I had supported my point of view with 10 arguments. But no body has been able to nullify these arguments. There is no question of sending troops to Iraq. Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh is much more clear than we people. When some journalist asked him whether India would send troops to Iraq or not. He said that there was no question of sending troops there. So it is the time that the government should stop uttering language of deception on this issue. A Muslim is always straightforward.

Voice of Islam: So all the things are taking place on the behest of Americans?

Hammed Gul: Yes, the action in Waziristan is taking place on dictation of imperialist powers. It will be over-simplified thinking if we consider that our government is not a part of world imperialism. Our government is a stakeholder in the international imperialism, which feels Jihadic philosophy as a big hurdle in the accomplishment of its plans.

Voice of Islam: Is the ongoing unrest in Waziristan similar to the one East Pakistan experienced in 1970?

Hameed Gul: Not at all. There is no possibility of any harm to Pakistan’s integrity. Just think of Wana. All sort of brutality is being meted out to the tribals in the form of bombing and killings. Yet no body has said that Punjabi army should go across the river Indus. Had they been nationalists, they could have said it. But they are staunch Muslims. They love Pakistan. They only oppose the policies of the government, not the country. The tribal people are ready to go to Kashmir to liberate the occupied valley instead of being killed at the hands of their own people.

Voice of Islam: Interim Prime Minister of Iraq, Ayyad Allawi has requested Pakistan to contribute its troops to the US-led coalition troops.

Hameed Gul: He is not interim Prime Minister of Iraq, but only the stooge of Americans. He can sell his nation or country, just for money from the Americans. Allawi does not represent his nation. Why should Pakistan send its troops on the request of such a con person? Voice of Islam: What will be the implications of on-going US campaign in Afghanistan and Iraq in the name of war on terrorism?

Hameed Gul: It is creating awakening among the Muslim world. There is nothing to be worried about as everything is positive. US is losing this war. Both freedom fighters putting up resistance against foreign occupation of their countries and those displaced from their homes and hearths are showing steadfastness of supreme nature. Even the cronies of imperialism are accepting that US may lose war. The defeat of America will have a boosting effect not only on Muslim world but also on anti-globalization movement. All those presently supporting imperialism will be in a state of despair at that time.

 Voice of Islam: Are raids on deeni madaris (seminaries) and arrest of Ulema in line with national interest?

Hameed Gul: These acts are unlawful. Those engaged in such things are acting contrary to teachings of Islam. They want to deprive the nation of Quran and Hadith. They are trying to deprive the Muslims of spirit of Jihad just by promoting skepticism. This means that they are not against Muslims but Quran. Our government is strengthening the infidels by dubbing jihad as extremism and sectarianism.

Voice of Islam: What is your opinion about government’s directives to teach science and other present day subjects in deeni madaris?

Hameed Gul: I can debate on this issue. If you are interested in the dissemination of worldly sciences at the seminaries, it is also advisable to teach Quran and Hadith in the public and government-run schools and colleges, as this is the basis of a Muslim’s education. Similarly, Pakistan’s constitution says that Allah, the almighty is the sovereign and Quran and Sunnah are the supreme laws. If it is so, then we have to read this law. But unfortunately, the government argues that these are private educational institutions, so it cannot ask them to teach Quran and Sunnah there. In reality, these are the institutions, which eat up big government funds. On the other hands, religious educational institutions demand not a single penny from government. Madaris have been run in an austere manner for centuries. They don’t want any privilege. It is not fair for the government to be too strict to madaris. These seminaries have never refused to disseminate worldly education to the students. All the allegations hurled on them are incorrect. Actually, both the government and its masters have not good intentions.

Voice of Islam: Ulema (religious leaders) have been target of terrorism lately. Some months ago, Mufti Nizamuddin Shamzai was killed. The recent victim is Maulana Ibrahim Salafi. Are these murders target killings or outcome of sectarianism?

Hameed Gul: I don’t know whether the assassination of Maulana Salafi was a target killing or not. But I do call the murder of Mufti Shamzai, Hakeem Said and Salahuddin because they were very known to me and I knew their ideas and services. Who is behind the assassination of Maulana Salafi, I don’t know. Certainly, the killers must be from Pakistan. But who masterminded the killing of ulema. This (killings) is the manifestation of imperialist thinking that has always been propagated by the United States. You must know that General Ziaul Haque’s death was yet another incident of target killing. They (perpetrators of the killings) are very callous.

Voice of Islam: President General Pervez Musharraf during his address at the recent International Inter-Faith conference in Islamabad said that no military group or Jaish parallel to Pak Army would be allowed to operate in Pakistan? How do you perceive this statement?

Hameed Gul: There has always been debate on whether some individual or group has right to declare or launch jihad without the backing of state. The indigenous groups in the occupied Kashmir are carrying out jihad. Being oppressed, Kashmiris are engaged in jihad to wriggle away from Indian jackboot. There are always two aspects of Jihad. It may be carried out for the dominance of Islam or to defend Islam. I admit that it is the state and the caliph who can declare jihad for the dominance of Islam over other religions and nations. But there is no caliphate in the world. Pakistan that was established in the name of Islam has not been able to become an Islamic state in real terms. Ideologically speaking, it is an Islamic country. But with the adoption of western system of governance, it is not a threat to the hegemonistic designs of West.

The second aspect of Jihad is the defense. There is no need of seeking permission from any body while defending one’s faith, homeland, property, freedom, honour and life. Kashmiris need not to seek any permission from President General Pervez Musharraf as they are defending themselves vis-à-vis Indian occupation forces in the valley. Moreover, they (Kashmiris) have been given the right to defend by the United Nations resolutions. A quotable example in the Islamic history is that of Salahuddin Ayubi who was not a ruler, but only commander who defeated Christian army during second Crusade and liberated Palestine. At present, some people while following the golden examples of Islamic history, supporting the oppressed Kashmiris without violating the laws of Pakistan. There is no justification to stop these persons from doing a noble act especially in the face of the fact that Pakistan Army is not fulfilling its responsibility in this regard. Rather, it has been using major chunk of country’s revenue in the name of liberating Kashmir.

By the way, I am confident that the process of Jihad will never cease. It will continue till Day of Judgment.

Voice of Islam: Composite dialogue between India and Pakistan is in progress since last year. But both the sides have not been able in discussing the core issue of Kashmir. How do you see this process?

Hameed Gul: This (dialogue) is just an act of deception being carried out on the behest of the Americans. Islamabad Declaration of January 6 is akin to Oslo Declaration that consolidated the dominance of Israel in the Middle East. The Islamabad declaration is just a stigma for Pakistani nation. Actually, India is pursuing the path of dialogue as a part of its efforts to improve its image in the outer world as a peace-loving country with an ultimate aim of getting permanent seat on UN Security Council.

Voice of Islam: Do you agree with present government’s Kashmir Policy?

Hameed Gul: As a matter of the fact, the Kashmir Policy of the government has failed. Despite all the failures on Kashmir issue, General Pervez Musharraf recently said that his commitment towards Kashmir was very strong. What is the use of this commitment when Pakistan is now left with no option? Pakistan government has used all the cards. It has talked to India without referring to the UN resolution. India has been allowed to erect barbed wire on the Line of Control by announcing unilateral ceasefire. Air and land links have been restored in addition to softening borders. Exchange of trade delegation is in progress. Actresses like Urmila have been allowed to visit Pakistan. I don’t know whether the government is left with some card that could help resolve the outstanding problem of Kashmir. In fact, there is no more option.

Voice of Islam: You have predicted the triumph of Kashmir Jihad. However if some conspiracy against it gets successful, to what extent, Muslims of Sub-continent will be affected?

Hameed Gul: The only silver lining we see in the present day scenario is Jihad. People in Kashmir are carrying out jihad by laying down their lives. God will give them reward. More the barbed wires and land mines, greater will be reward from Allah the Almighty for Kashmiries struggling against Indian occupation forces. However, I must warn that in case of failure of Jihad due to wrong policies and defeatist mentality of the rulers, the future of 400 million Muslims of Sub-continent will become dark, paving way for the resurgence of Brahmin raj across South Asia.

Voice of Islam: Is the statement of Chairman All Parties Hurriyat Conference, Syed Ali Gillani in favour of Independent Kashmir reflective of his disappointment regarding Pakistan?

Hameed Gul: I think, Kashmiris are getting disappointed with Pakistan. I will not blame them (Kashmiris) for it. Pakistan’s present Kashmir policy has put them on a weak wicket. US has also been interested in an Independent state of Kashmir for a long time and it is trying to create such a psychological situation among Kashmiries that they should feel a betrayal on the part of Pakistan. As far as Gillani’s statement is concerned, India knows whenever the Kashmiris would be asked to vote in favour of accession to Pakistan or India or an Independent state of Kashmir, they (Kashmiris) will definitely vote for Pakistan. This is the major factor that India has always avoided plebiscite under UN resolutions.

Voice of Islam: What is Darfur problem? Is another East Timor in the making?

Hameed Gul: Firstly, oil has been discovered in Sudan. This African country has very important geo-strategic position and a large land mass. It is abundant with fertile lands and underground water. Seconly, Sudan is located at a place in Africa where Muslims are in majority in its small while Christians dominate south. The West and US want to transform Africa into a Christian continent. Darfur and the adjoining areas where the oil has been explored, are pre-dominantly Christian areas. That’s why, America and its cronies want to balkanize Sudan in the name of human rights with an ultimate aim to create an East-Timor like state.

Voice of Islam: Mutahidda Majlis-e-Aml (MMA) secured votes in the name of Islam and Jihad in 2002 General Elections? Is it still following its manifesto?

Hameed Gul: Nation in general and Jihadic organizations in particular are disappointed with the present role of MMA. Defence of Afghanistan Council that comprised more than 35 religious parties, was actually the sequel or follow up MMA. Jehadis, being freedom fighters, had laid down their lives for the nation. So the masses responded to them very positively. Jehadic elements always took MMA as an umbrella organization. Yet they (MMA) became more political than religious. Now only the time can tell whether MMA returns to its Jehadic philosophy for which nation voted for it in 2002 elections. But there is still a hope against hopes that MMA will return to its real manifesto, as the President’s Uniform controversy will definitely force them to return to their roots.

Voice of Islam: President’s Uniform has become a controversy. Should General Musharraf doff his uniform?

Hameed Gul: President General Pervez Musharraf should take off his Bush-Shirt before the uniform. By taking off Bush-shirt, he can invoke the blessings of Allah, the almighty. Uniform is not a big issue. The major problem is the Bush-Shirt that he has worn under the uniform. He should rule the country with an aim to serve the nation and the Islamic faith.

Website Main Page